Official Report: Tuesday 10 December 2024
The Assembly met at 10:30 am (Mr Speaker in the Chair).
Members observed two minutes' silence.
Mr Speaker: Before Members' statements, I need to deal with issues that arose yesterday.
During yesterday's debate on the Assembly Commission's budget, there were a number of disorderly exchanges, which included two individual challenges to rulings from the Chair, by Mr Gaston and Dr Aiken, that were of a nature that needs to be returned to this morning. I can confirm that Mr Gaston has written to me directly about the same issue. I am disappointed, however, to see that, before I could respond, he had shared his letter with the media. That is something that is not in keeping with parliamentary courtesy.
I refer Members to the start of Assembly business on 4 November 2024, when I made the following comments:
"I remind Members that, regardless of whether decisions are taken by me or delegated to the Principal Deputy Speaker or Deputy Speakers, they are procedural decisions that are taken impartially in consultation with the advice of officials on the requirements of Standing Orders. Members are aware that the Chair's decisions are final and that it is out of order to challenge them. Upholding the authority and impartiality of the Chair is an issue for not only the Deputy Speakers and me but all Members. If it becomes a trend that Members seek to abuse our procedures and conventions by playing party politics with the Chair's decisions, the Chair can take account of that, particularly when Members seek permission to raise an item or catch the eye of the Speaker or a Deputy Speaker." — [Official Report (Hansard), 4 November 2024, p1, cols 1-2].
It is in that context that I will make a couple of reflections on yesterday's exchanges. First, although there may have been the potential to raise issues relating to the Michael McMonagle situation within the scope of the debate on the Assembly Commission budget, that would have needed to be done in a way that was clearly relevant. Mr Gaston, however, did not raise issues in a way that was within the scope of the debate. When the Principal Deputy Speaker gave Mr Gaston the opportunity to adapt his remarks to bring them within scope, as other Members would be used to, Mr Gaston instead went off on a further tangent to make references to the Committee for the Executive Office and to take issue with the Principal Deputy Speaker.
Secondly, Members will have heard me say in the past that, even if I disagree with Members' comments, I will defend, from the Speaker's Chair, their right to make them.
While Mr Carroll made reference to companies in a way that, I think, was unwise, he did so within the scope of the debate and made his comments relevant to the budget.
Having observed the proceedings and spoken to officials, I can confirm that the Principal Deputy Speaker's decisions were in order and in accordance with procedural advice. Whether or not Mr Gaston agreed, the crucial point is that that was the Chair's ruling, which is final and is not open to debate.
What cannot be tolerated is the nature of the exchanges with the Principal Deputy Speaker. It was further disappointing that a Member who serves as a Deputy Speaker also got involved in challenging the Chair in that way. Members who serve as Deputy Speakers should know better than to undermine the procedures of the House, from which they benefit, and I cannot make an exception for a Deputy Speaker.
Today, when we have a particularly significant debate, I remind all Members that Standing Order 1(2) makes clear:
"The Speaker's ruling shall be final on all questions of procedure and order."
That includes the decisions of the Principal Deputy Speaker and the Deputy Speakers in my absence. Members should accept it in good faith that the rulings from the Chair are based on the procedures of the House. That is why the Clerks are at the Table with us: to allow us to take procedural advice as business proceeds. If I or a Deputy Speaker give an instruction, such as on a Member's time being up or on sticking to the scope of the debate, there is no discussion to be had. Members should adapt their remarks accordingly rather than begin a dispute with the Chair.
Challenges to a ruling of the Chair on a procedural decision would not be tolerated in Westminster or anywhere in these islands, and I will not tolerate them in the Assembly or see the authority of the Chair, the discipline of the Chamber and the smooth running of our business diminished. Members should be absolutely clear on that. In line with similar direct challenges to the Chair during previous Assembly mandates, it is clear to me that a sanction would be appropriate in the case of Mr Gaston and Dr Aiken. In previous cases, when Members have challenged the Chair in such a serious fashion, the relevant Members were not called for some time. However, I am conscious of our business today, and I would be prepared to waive that sanction if Mr Gaston or Dr Aiken were to apologise to the House in the Chamber this morning. In the absence of an apology, both Members will not be called to speak in any plenary business, including debates, questions, interventions and points of order, for two sitting weeks, beginning today.
I will leave that with you. If Members wish to apologise, I will facilitate that.
Dr Aiken: Mr Speaker, thank you for your words. Obviously, considerable issues have been raised about the comments that were made yesterday. I fully accept your ruling, and I apologise to the House. The only thing that I wish to do in the House is ensure that there is good order, good governance and, above all, proper debate. I apologise, Mr Speaker.
Mr Speaker: Thank you very much, Dr Aiken. I understand that, in the heat of the moment, things can get out of control. I appreciate your apology.
We will move on to Members' statements.
Ms Ferguson: Housing is a human right and forms part of the right to an adequate standard of living guaranteed by the International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights. Under international law, to be adequately housed means having real security of tenure. On Human Rights Day, it is timely to remind us all of our ongoing collective responsibility to tackle poverty and existing housing inequalities across our society, ensuring that no one is left behind.
Key elements that are considered when assessing the right to adequate housing include security of tenure; affordability; habitability, accessibility; the availability of services; location, including access to support; and cultural adequacy. Delivering housing across all tenures is fundamental, but we must also work to prevent evictions and tackle any discriminatory patterns of social exclusion that prevent people from accessing suitable housing. Whilst the UN Committee on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights' General Comment No 7 of 1997 is approaching three decades of existence, it is to be commended for its clear and unequivocal commentary on evictions:
"Evictions should not result in individuals being rendered homeless or"
"vulnerable to the violation of other human rights."
With almost 48,000 households on the social housing waiting list at present, we have a duty to once again consider housing as our collective duty, particularly in the context of the fulfilment of human rights, and to reconsider how we will ensure that resources are pooled across the Executive and Assembly to progressively realise that right to the maximum ability of our available resources.
I welcome the publication of the housing supply strategy by the Minister yesterday, but I also ask the Minister to confirm when we can expect the regulations. The regulations will bring forward the work of our predecessors to deliver much longer notice-to-quit periods for those living in the private rented sector. Equally, I again urge the Minister to reconsider his refusal to legislate to end the use of no-fault evictions. While I appreciate some of the challenges that he has raised on the basis of the Scottish case, for example, those challenges are not insurmountable and, arguably, are not an exceptional justification for a lack of legislation in the area. I suggest further engaging on that with the likes of Renters' Voice and Housing Rights, which have already been considering potential proposals for the development of very limited acceptable grounds for exceptions.
Mr Kingston: I commend the work of Westland Community Group in North Belfast and wish, in particular, to celebrate the allocation of Urban Villages funding for a new Westland Community Centre, which was confirmed by junior Minister Reilly in the Chamber yesterday in response to questions for oral answer from Phillip Brett and me. I met the Westland Community Group committee last night. It is, of course, delighted with the allocation of £1·6 million for the new, purpose-built community centre.
Westland is an estate of just over 200 houses. Built by the Housing Executive over 50 years ago, it is now a mixture of social housing, owner-occupied properties and private rentals. The Westland Community Group was started 42 years ago, and, 23 years ago, the group received a second-hand prefabricated community centre from the lower Oldpark area as a temporary measure. With structural supports physically holding up the roof, the group got as much use as it could out of that centre until, five years ago, it was finally condemned and had to be demolished. There have been many efforts over the years to secure funding for a new centre. Now, thanks to Urban Villages, which sits in the Executive Office, that has been achieved.
I congratulate the community group's committee, under chairperson Robert Hollywood, for its dedication and tenacity in reaching this breakthrough moment. Vice chair, Katie Shoukri, who has been a member of the committee since the very start, 42 years ago, and is a former chairperson deserves a special mention. "Well done" to Katie for that long commitment. I also give special thanks to officials from the Urban Villages team, particularly Joe Hinds, and from Belfast City Council, particularly community worker Siobhan Shannon, and to all others who have supported the group in its campaign. I make special mention of councillors Fred Cobain and Jordan Doran and, previously, Harry Smith of Intercomm.
Considering that Westland is such a small area, I have been impressed by the energy and activities of Westland Community Group. Even without a centre, it managed to hold summer schemes, community fun days and pensioners' dinners. I have every confidence that it will make great use of the future centre for the Westland community and others who will benefit from it. In the patchwork quilt of North Belfast, Westland is a predominantly unionist community, but the community group participates in various cross-community activities and is becoming more ethnically diverse. People from neighbouring areas attend its fun days and other activities.
Now that there is a clear pathway to the delivery of the new centre, the relevant agencies must continue to support the Westland Community Group. I trust that the letter of offer will be issued soon. Again, congratulations to all concerned.
Ms Nicholl: On Wednesday 4 December, a much-loved doctor and teaching assistant in our city received the news that they had been dreading. Nineteen members of their family in Gaza had been killed by Israeli air strikes: a mother, a brother, an uncle, cousins and children. Looking for safety, they had been evacuated nine times, and, each time they moved to a new area, they were in danger. They were killed in their tents, burned alive by bombs.
It is important to stress that nowhere in Gaza is safe. People cannot be evacuated; the borders are closed. Nothing has been done.
When I spoke to Omar, whose family members were killed, he said that he wanted his family to be remembered, because every human being has importance, value and worth. Therefore, I will read out the names of his family members who were killed on Wednesday 4 December: Akram Wael Akram Al-Masry; Julia Osama Muhammad Barhoum; Abdullah Musa Abdullah Al-Astal; Haitham Muhammad Abdullah Abu Mustafa; Muhammad Ahmad Hussein Juma; Yahya Muhammad Ahmad Juma; Bassem Abdullah Youssef Hassanein, who was Dalal's mother; Fawqiya Abdul Rahim Diab Lafi; Israa Muhammad Suleiman Al-Astal; Jouri Osama Muhammad Barhoum; Sham Ali Younis Shurab; Shaima Muhammad Fathi Al-Majayda; Wafaa Ali Younis Shurab; Ahmed Muhammad Ahmad Juma; Mahmoud Muhammad Ahmad Juma; Layan Bassem Abdullah Abu Hassanein; Khalil Hussein Khalil Lafi; Osama Afif Abdullah Ghanem; and Latifa Bassem Abdullah Hassanein. Four people remain unidentified because of the devastation.
Every life has value. Every person has value. The international community has to do something. People cannot keep dying. There were children in that family who were killed. It is an outrage and an atrocity. My heart goes out to every member of our Palestinian community today who feels that devastation and is worried for their family members.
Mr McGrath: I rise to congratulate the Downpatrick Dramability group, which is a mixed-ability group that puts on various performances throughout the year and has a pantomime at Christmastime, which I attended on Saturday past. MLAs get the opportunity to do lots of things during their tenure, but I wonder whether I can top it all, because, at the weekend, I got to save Christmas. As the show progressed, it became apparent that one person in the audience did not truly believe in Christmas. In fact, that one person in the audience, who was unknown at the time, was referred to as a Grinch. This caused Santa Claus to be locked in a dungeon and not able to do his duties. As the show progressed, it became apparent that the Grinch was me, and I was brought onstage to take part in the performance. In so doing, I was able to unlock the present that was on the stage, which enabled me to become an elf and, therefore, believe in Christmas. That meant that Santa Claus got out of jail, so he will be able to perform all his activities on Christmas Eve.
I thank the group for its performance. As I said, it is a mixed-ability group. Under the guidance of Bette Liddell, it has been working for years. It practises every week for its performances. It puts its heart and soul into its performances. The members have an opportunity to come together to socialise, to learn from each other and, especially, to grow in confidence and be very welcomed, loved and cherished members of our community. I absolutely love the shows. They are enjoyed by the hundreds who attend them each year. At the end of each show, the members take great relish in telling the audience that we were "absolutely average". I was proud to be part of their "average" pantomime at the weekend to assist them in saving Christmas. I am absolutely delighted, through the work of the Downpatrick Dramability group, that I believe, and that I can be that elf this Christmas.
Mr Speaker: I remind Members that props and displays are not to be used in the Chamber
but, in the spirit of Christmas, I will let the Member away with it on this occasion.
Ms Sheerin: Ár gcearta, ár dtodhchaí anois díreach.
Inniu Lá Idirnáisiúnta Chearta an Duine. Is inniu a dhéanaimid ár machnamh ar an dul chun cinn a rinneadh agus a aithnímid go bhfuil bearnaí ann go fóill.
Déanaimid comóradh inniu, nó is ar an lá seo tá sé bliana is seachtó ó shin a síníodh Dearbhú Uilechoiteann Chearta an Duine. Sa 1948, bhí an domhain faoi léan i ndiaidh ar fhulaing sé d’uafáis bharbartha. I ndiaidh chrá agus phian an Uileloiscthe, tháinig ceannairí domhanda le chéile lena rá: "Choíche arís". D’fhógair siad na cearta doshannta a bhfuil gach neach daonna ina dteideal, beag beann ar chine, ar reiligiún ná ar náisiúntacht. Rinne siad é sin i ndúil is nach mbeadh aon ghrúpa daoine faoi leatrom choíche arís.
Bheadh comhionannas, dínit agus saoirse ag gach duine.
Ar an drochuair, níor chomhlíon an domhan na gealltanais a rinneadh ag an am sin, agus is maith is eol dúinne an dochar a dhéantar nuair a shéantar cearta an duine. Tá easpa ceart sa Tuaisceart: níor comhlíonadh na gealltanais a rinneadh sa bhliain 1998 go fóill, agus tá an beagán ag séanadh bhille na gceart ar an mhórán.
Ar fud an domhain, tá cearta daoine leochaileacha faoi ionsaí gach aon lá. Is ar Gaza, thar áit ar bith eile, a smaoinímid agus ar mhuintir na Palaistíne, atá faoi chinedhíothú le níos mó ná 14 mhí. Fiú roimh an 7 Deireadh Fómhair bhí siad faoi fhorghabháil.
Caithfimid bheith ag súil le níos fearr, ach caithfimid obair ar a shon.
Caithfimid ár gcearta dár dtodchaí a bheith againn anois díreach.
[Translation: Our rights, our future, right now.
Today is International Human Rights Day, a day to take stock of the progress made and acknowledge where the gaps are.
Today we commemorate the 76th anniversary of the signing of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. In 1948, the world was reeling from unspeakable evil, and in the wake of the hurt and pain of the Holocaust, world leaders came together to say, "Never again". They declared the inalienable rights that every human being is entitled to, regardless of race, religion, or nationality. They did so in the hope that it would mean that no group of people would ever face discrimination again.
Equality, dignity, and freedom for all individuals.
Unfortunately, our world has not lived up to the promises made at that time, and we ourselves are no stranger to the harms caused by denial of rights. We live in a rights deficit in the North: the promises of 1998 have still not been fulfilled, and a bill of rights for all people is denied to many by the few.
Across the world, the rights of vulnerable people are under attack on a daily basis, nowhere more so than in Gaza, where we think of the Palestinian people enduring genocide for more than 14 months now. Even before 7 October, they were living under occupation.
We must hope for better, but we must work to deliver it.
Our rights, for our future, right now.]
Ms Brownlee: I rise to address the issue of derelict buildings in East Antrim, which has been a long-standing source of frustration and concern for the local community, local council and, of course, local traders. A number of properties are in a state of serious dilapidation, which not only undermines the aesthetics and safety of those areas but hinders efforts to revitalise the heart of our town centres.
After storm Darragh at the weekend, a building in West Street, Carrickfergus, was declared unsafe by the Northern Ireland Fire and Rescue Service. That area has been closed to traffic and pedestrians, which will result in further reduced footfall during the important Christmas period. Of course, the weather cannot be blamed; that building has been left to go to ruins with no regard for the domino effect that that has on the area. The council has been left without any real power to take action.
The Northern Ireland Assembly's proposed dilapidation Bill will, hopefully, provide a crucial framework to tackle such properties by empowering local councils to take decisive action on abandoned and unsafe buildings. That proposed legislation could offer an effective tool to compel owners to repair or redevelop those sites. West Street in Carrickfergus and the likes of Dunluce Street in Larne are, of course, prime examples of areas where that legislation could be used to great effect. In its current state, that site is a stark reminder of neglect and how that adversely affects surrounding businesses, residents and, of course, Carrickfergus's image as a key tourist destination.
I urge the Minister of Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs to update the House on progress on the introduction of the proposed dilapidation Bill, work alongside local authorities to fully embrace the powers that that dilapidation Bill could provide, and prioritise properties and areas such as those I mentioned. The residents of East Antrim deserve a clear plan and a clear timeline for action, whether through enforcement mechanisms, cost recovery mechanisms, broader powers and, of course, clarity. Action must be taken before it is too late, or someone will be seriously injured.
Mr Dickson: As others have mentioned, today, we mark Human Rights Day. On 10 December 1948, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights was pledged to the world at the United Nations General Assembly in Paris. That historic document provided the fundamental rights for every human being as we know them today. The pledge established that people deserve to have their humanity protected at a baseline level, regardless of race, gender, sexuality, colour or status. It is a promise to respect other people, transcend our differences and strive for a better world.
The year 2024 also marks the 75th anniversary of the Council of Europe, of which the United Kingdom was a founding member and which is the custodian of the European Court of Human Rights. For the 76th anniversary, the United Nations has called for an acknowledgement of the importance of human rights in our daily lives. That requires us to tackle misinformation, counter disinformation and seek to mobilise human rights as a global movement. As Deputy Chair of the Committee for the Executive Office, I mirror that sentiment and highlight the need for an equality Act in Northern Ireland similar to that in the rest of the United Kingdom. It is past time that we brought legislation that consolidates human rights, protects them as a singular entity and ends the disjointed systems that we currently have.
In Northern Ireland, no legislation protects us from age discrimination in accessing goods, facilities and services, yet there are protections for those on every other equality ground. Whilst disability discrimination is technically legislated for, there is no law against indirect discrimination. That shortfall was addressed in the rest of the United Kingdom by the Equality Act 2010, 14 years ago. We need to look at Northern Ireland's harrowing shortfalls in its ability to protect women and girls from violence. It is horrifying to think that we have one of the most dangerous places in Europe for a woman to live. We must continue to press that issue and support the framework for ending violence against women and girls completely and undeniably.
I paint that picture to show that, whilst we have come a long way in the past 76 years, there is still progress to be made in Northern Ireland. As we look back on our accomplishments on this historic anniversary, I urge us all to turn our attention to the future and a Northern Ireland that is fair for all.
Mr McAleer: Members, we were all saddened last night to learn of the passing of Tyrone GAA football legend Jody Gormley. I extend my sympathy, thoughts and prayers to his wife, Deirdre; his children, Aine, James and Niamh; and the wider Gormley family circle.
Jody had a distinguished football career with his beloved club, Trillick St Macartans in Tyrone, as a footballer and as a manager. He also had huge success with Tyrone GAA and London GAA, and he won a County Down junior championship with Bredagh GAC. He showed great grit and determination on the field. Any of us who follow Gaelic games will remember when he scored the winning point in the famous victory in the 1995 Ulster semi-final against Derry; indeed, I was one of the many people who were there to cheer him on. He was a distinguished coach with the County Down and County Antrim teams. He won the Tommy Murphy Cup with Antrim, which was the last silverware that was won by the Antrim county footballers. As a teacher, he led Abbey Christian Brothers' Grammar School to win its first MacRory Cup in 19 years, and it went on to win the Hogan Cup. I extend my thoughts and prayers to his pupils, who are also feeling his loss.
When Jody announced his illness a few months ago, he faced it with incredible inspiration and bravery that inspired us all. Anyone who has heard Thomas Niblock's podcast episode with him will know his bravery and the love that he had for his family. He did not fear death coming at all, but he regretted that he would not live to see his children blossom and share in their life experiences, such as his son, James, playing football for Trillick.
On that podcast, Jody said that he wanted to be remembered as a:
"decent person who helped people out as much as I could".
That is exactly what he did. He was truly an inspiration, and he will be for ever remembered.
Mr Speaker: Before we move to the next item of business, I inform Members that, as the Business Committee is not meeting today, there will be no lunchtime suspension. Business will continue until 2.00 pm, when Question Time will commence.
I also wish to inform Members that I have been notified that the proposer of the Adjournment debate topic relating to South Belfast, Ms Paula Bradshaw, will not speak to that topic, so there will be no Adjournment debate.
Mr Gaston: In light of the business that we are considering later, I accept your ruling, Mr Speaker, on the matter that you brought to our attention at the start of business. I apologise for my part in yesterday's proceedings.
Mr Speaker: Thank you for that, Mr Gaston. I have been on the wrong side of the Speaker on many occasions in my career, and it is part of life. I appreciate you doing that.
Mr Brett: On a point of order, Mr Speaker. Thank you for your earlier rulings on business in the House. May I seek your ruling? The Principal Deputy Speaker devoted her Member's statement yesterday to me, and I am happy to be debated. However, I was not prewarned by the Principal Deputy Speaker that she would use her Member's statement to reflect on me. Will you rule on whether a Member should give advance notice when they are going to name another Member of this place?
Mr Speaker: The Minister for Infrastructure has given notice that he wishes to make a statement. I call the Minister for Infrastructure.
[Translation: Thank you, Mr Speaker.]
Before I formally introduce the statement, I add my sympathies to the friends and family of Jody Gormley. He is a great loss to them and to the entire community.
With your permission, a Cheann Comhairle
[Translation: Mr Speaker]
and in compliance with section 52 of the Northern Ireland Act 1998, I wish to make the following statement to the Assembly about the British-Irish Council (BIC) planning and places ministerial meeting that I chaired on 8 November 2004 in Derry and at which junior Minister Cameron was also in attendance.
Members will be aware that the British-Irish Council, established in 1999, is a forum for its members to discuss, consult and cooperate on matters of mutual interest that are within the competence of its member Administrations. The British-Irish Council planning and places work sector is chaired by my Department on behalf of the Executive. The group provides a constructive forum for sharing best practice on issues of common interest and promotes practical collaboration.
The ministerial meeting held on 8 November 2024 in Derry focused on the work that the planning and places work sector had taken forward between 2021 and 2024 in key areas of planning, particularly around the revitalisation of towns and building better places in the context of the COVID recovery. Ministers commended the work that had been done and endorsed both the work sector report and a 'Placemaking in Practice' report, which was compiled following a symposium held in Cardiff in September 2023.
Ministers agreed the forward work programme for 2025-27, which focuses on two themes: climate change and the biodiversity emergency; and skills and capacity for the public-sector planning profession.
Member Administrations face the urgent challenge of addressing climate change and the impacts on biodiversity