Official Report: Minutes of Evidence
Committee for Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs, meeting on Thursday, 22 May 2025
Members present for all or part of the proceedings:
Mr Robbie Butler (Chairperson)
Mr Declan McAleer (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr John Blair
Mr Tom Buchanan
Ms Aoife Finnegan
Mr William Irwin
Mr Patsy McGlone
Miss Michelle McIlveen
Agriculture Bill: Agreement of Draft Report and Recommendations
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): We will now agree our draft Committee report and recommendations on the Agriculture Bill. I refer members to the final draft report in their pack. The Committee Clerk issued an updated draft report by email on 13 May, with the addition of the discussions and formal clause-by-clause agreement from the Committee's meeting on 8 May. No amendments or suggested additions to the report have been received from members to date. The report needs to be finalised at today's meeting and lodged in the Business Office tomorrow in order to conclude the Bill's Committee Stage.
We will now go through the draft report in sections. Please stop me if there is anything that you wish to add or change. Please let me know that you have the final draft report in front of you and indicate if you are having any difficulties accessing it. Is everyone content?
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): We will start with the "Powers and Membership" section, which begins on page 3 of the draft report. Are members content with that section?
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): The next section is titled "List of Abbreviations and Acronyms used in this Report". It begins on page 4. Are members content with that section?
Members indicated assent.
Are members content with that section?
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): If any member needs another minute or two to clarify anything, please tell me to hold fire.
The next section is titled "Introduction", which is paragraphs 21 to 56 and starts on page 9.
Are members content with that section?
"It was then around five months before the Bill was actually introduced to the Northern Ireland Assembly."
Can we not be more specific?
The Committee Clerk: We can change that.
Miss McIlveen: We should take out the first sentence so that the paragraph begins:
"DAERA Officials then briefed the Committee on 12 December".
Miss McIlveen: I am being pedantic. The first sentence is not of any substance.
The Committee Clerk: I will put in a specific time if I can. If not, we will take out the sentence.
If you were always this quiet, it would be great.
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): We will move on to "Context and Overview", which is paragraphs 57 to 96. The section starts on page 16 and runs through to page 24.
Miss McIlveen: May I ask about the square brackets in paragraph 80? Will those be a permanent feature in the report?
The Committee Clerk: There was an updated position, so that line was probably added after we started drafting the report. We had found out that the scheme would continue.
The Committee Clerk: The square brackets can be changed to round brackets. They should be taken out.
The Committee Clerk: That is fine.
Miss McIlveen: The continuation of that sentence in paragraph 80 needs to be changed to add the word "to", as it currently reads:
"the rules and legislation would need be kept under regular review."
I presume, however, that you will check for typos before the report is submitted.
The Committee Clerk: Yes, we will.
Mr Blair: There is a small typo in paragraph 95. There is a space before the hyphen before the word "specific".
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): Thank you. We will move on to "Committee Recommendations", which are paragraphs 97 to 106, which start on page 24 and run through to page 26.
The Committee Clerk: I picked up the recommendations from evidence and discussions, but if members wish to add any, that is fine.
Miss McIlveen: The recommendations refer to "the Committee" throughout and do not identify members, but the final recommendation, which is at paragraph 106, mentions "The Chair". Is that what we normally do?
The Committee Clerk: That is in there because it refers to an issue that the Chair in particular brought up. As I said, I have just drafted the recommendations. I can assign specific members to them, however.
Miss McIlveen: For consistency, can the wording be changed to "The Committee recommends"?
The Committee Clerk: No problem. That is fine. I can remove that reference, if members are content.
Mr Blair: Or perhaps change it to "A majority of members".
The Committee Clerk: Yes. I will change it to "A majority of members".
The Committee Clerk: I tend to use the words "The Committee" for the recommendations unless any member is particularly against any of them.
The Committee Clerk: No, it is not the same in the later paragraphs on the clauses.
The Committee Clerk: That section is where it is more important to record people's views.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): Does anybody want to pick up on any other points in "Committee Recommendations"? If not, are members therefore content?
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): We will move on to "Consideration of the Bill". Paragraphs 107 to 128, which start on page 27, give a summary of the evidence received from the Citizen Space survey and specifically that from the mushroom sector.
Miss McIlveen: Paragraph 124 starts by stating, "In Ireland" when it should state, "In the Republic of Ireland".
The Committee Clerk: Sorry, which paragraph?
The Committee Clerk: No problem. That was probably cut and pasted.
The Committee Clerk: No problem. Thank you.
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): We will move to "Committee Deliberations on the Bill", which is at paragraphs 129 to 192. We will take this section in shorter parts. We will look at paragraphs 129 to 132 in the first instance.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): Yes, 129 to 132: They are the four paragraphs on page 32. That is pretty much a factual piece. Are members content?
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): Good. Thank you.
We will look at "Delegated Powers", which spans three paragraphs — 133 to 136 — and summarises the advice from the Examiner of Statutory Rules (ESR).
The Committee Clerk: We cannot change her advice.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): Yes, we cannot change the ESR's advice. This is more about grammar and that type of thing. We discussed the Henry VIII clauses right at the start of our deliberations. We can get our heads around that again.
The Committee Clerk: As the ESR's advice is privileged legal advice, Chair, I can put in only a high-level summary.
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): Thank you.
Paragraph 137 is titled "Clause 1 — Aid in the fruit and vegetables sector: amendment of CMO Regulation". We are looking at paragraphs 137 to 160.
"Officials replied that by the scheme is available"
should read, "while the scheme".
The Committee Clerk: Thanks, Michelle.
Miss McIlveen: Perhaps it could just read, "Officials replied that", taking out "by".
The Committee Clerk: Yes. I will take that out.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): Clause 1 attracted most of the Committee's attention. It was the most significant clause throughout our deliberations. Do members wish to talk about anything to do with the clause? If not, are members content that the paragraphs are OK?
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): Paragraphs 161 to 170 are titled "Clause 2 – Aid in the fruit and vegetables sector: power to modify". They start on page 37 and run through to page 39.
The Committee Clerk: Those paragraphs contain a summary of as much of the discussion as we could put in, but the full deliberations and discussions are available in the Hansard reports, which will be attached to the report.
The Committee Clerk: I have found a spelling mistake in paragraph 172. The first "it" should be "is", so I will change that.
The Committee Clerk: No matter how many times you look at these things, you always find something else.
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): We will move on to the section on clause 3, which is titled "Information provision and promotion measures: power to modify", which is paragraphs 171 to 176, starting on page 39 of the draft report. Again, this is a more of factual summary.
The Committee Clerk: There were no issues with that clause.
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): We will move on to the section on clause 4, titled, "Regulations", which is paragraphs 177 to 183. It starts on page 40 of the draft report and finishes at the bottom of page 41. The clause was supported by all respondents to the call for evidence.
The Committee Clerk: And by the Committee.
The Committee Clerk: The team will run a final spellcheck.
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): We will look at the section on clause 5, titled "Interpretation", which is paragraphs 184 to 191, from page 42 to the top of page 43.
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): We will now look at the section on clause 6, titled "Commencement and Short Title", which is paragraphs 192 to 195, from page 43 to the top of page 44. That one is fairly easy to read through. Are members content?
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): We now come on to the section on the formal clause-by-clause scrutiny of the Bill, which is paragraphs 196 to 204, starting on page 44 and finishing on page 45. It has short sentences. That is the record of the clause-by-clause voting.
The Committee Clerk: Only the paragraph on clause 1 has something in it.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): Yes.
There are then the links to appendices, which we have already boxed off. Does anyone have any issues with the clause-by-clause scrutiny section of the report? If not, are members content?
Members indicated assent.
The Chairperson (Mr Butler): Members, thank you very much. That concludes the Committee's deliberations and recording of information on the report on the Bill. Thank you for your time.
The Committee Clerk: Chair, is the Committee content that I make the minor amendments to the draft report and that we then send the final report to the Business Office?
Members indicated assent.