Official Report: Minutes of Evidence

The Chairperson (Ms Ferguson): I welcome Brian Ervine, head of environmental farming branch, and Leanne McGrath, deputy principal. Thank you for coming along this morning to brief the Committee. You may give your evidence when you are ready.

Mr Brian Ervine (Department of Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs): Good morning. Thank you for the opportunity to update the Committee on this proposed EU regulation amending regulation (EU) 2018/848 on organic production.

Organic farming is a production system that focuses on sustainability, animal health and welfare, human health and food quality and using natural processes. It avoids the use of chemical nitrogen fertilisers and chemical plant protection products. There is an EU regime to make sure that products marketed as organic are labelled as such and meet EU standards.

As EU policy has developed, a lot of organic production regulation has been put in place, and regulation (EU) 2018/848 was a major update on regulations from 2007. It came into operation in 2022, but an expert group subsequently looked at how the regulations were working, which is how the proposals to make simplifications and improvements through changes in production standards and thresholds for small operators have arisen.

The changes are principally about the trade in organic products with third countries outside the EU. For countries producing to standards similar to those of the EU, the term "equivalence" is used. When countries demonstrate that they meet those standards, their products are recognised as equivalent. That is important, because there is significant trade in such products between the EU and countries outside the EU. That affects Northern Ireland, because the organic sector in Northern Ireland is small — there are about 190 registered certified organic operators, including producers and processors — meaning that demand for organic produce is not fulfilled by home production, so there is a reliance on imports from GB, the EU and the rest of the world.

The proposal is detailed, but it is all about simplification and streamlining things, so we have an EU regulation that is about less regulation, in a way, and about simplification, which is a pleasant change. That is the aim. An important part of it is the recognition of equivalence, because the current arrangements for recognition of the equivalence of products from rest-of-the-world countries will end at the end of this year. The intention had been to develop that process through such things as trade agreements with the countries. Those are not sufficiently advanced, however, so the proposal extends the recognition of equivalence for 10 years until 2036 to allow those things to happen. If the proposal is not accepted, the countries in the rest of the world would lose their recognition of equivalence. That recognition is important in maintaining supplies from the rest of the world.

Other aspects of the proposal relate to use of the "EU organic" logo for countries that bring in produce that is recognised as equivalent.

That is the thrust of the proposal. There are benefits to it: it will reduce the administrative burden in some areas; it will streamline production standards; and, in particular, it will maintain the recognition of equivalence for rest-of-the-world countries. A total of 11 countries outside the EU represent the main organic traders with the EU.

That is the overall picture, and we are happy to take questions.

The Chairperson (Ms Ferguson): Thank you, Brian.

Mr Buckley: Thank you, Brian, for giving us advance sight of your written answers to our questions, which has helped us to analyse the flows of trade. I was taken aback that there are so few organic producers in Northern Ireland: 192. For the record, given that Northern Ireland largely fulfils its organic produce needs from outside, do you, as per your written response, anticipate that the proposal will have no impact, because it means less regulation of produce coming from GB into Northern Ireland? Is that correct?

Mr Ervine: The proposal certainly does not add to regulation and will simplify some aspects of it.

Mr Buckley: The extension to 2036 is largely to allow the process to flow more smoothly.

Mr Ervine: The extension is to allow the trade agreements to be worked on with the countries that are recognised as equivalent.

Mr Buckley: What engagement has the Department had with the sector? I will go through a couple of examples. Has there been consultation with the sector on the changes to withdrawal periods for vet medicines?

Mr Ervine: The consultation is led by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (DEFRA). It is the Northern Ireland competent authority because it is the competent authority for organic policy for the whole of the UK. The engagement has been done through the organic control bodies, which is the normal route. The organic control bodies liaise with their members and the producers and operators that they certify.

Mr Buckley: OK. Is it fair to say that the Department has had no direct consultation on that point with the wider poultry sector and agrisector in Northern Ireland?

Mr Ervine: That is correct. All the engagement is through DEFRA and the control bodies.

Mr Buckley: Is DAERA aware of any local companies or stakeholders having responded to the EU's consultation on the proposal?

Ms Leanne McGrath (Department of Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs): We are not aware of any engagement with or responses from companies in Northern Ireland to date.

Mr Buckley: The Committee can take up the point at a later date. I would like to see engagement with the Ulster Farmers' Union and the poultry sector on how a number of the issues affect them. The broad position that Brian set out means less regulation and, therefore, fewer issues. However, I am keen to hear their view and put it on the record. Thank you. I will follow up on those questions post this engagement.

Mr Martin: Thank you for coming in, Brian and Leanne. First, it is refreshing to have a positive piece of general legislation that will streamline things.

My question is about the 192 organic producers: does your evidence say, in essence, that the demand for organic produce in Northern Ireland outstrips supply?

Mr Ervine: Yes. There are different elements to that. For example, we cannot produce organic bananas here, but we produce organic beef, poultry and eggs. It is fair to say that the main volume of our production is in poultry, eggs and beef.

Mr Martin: Are you telling me that the greatest country in the world cannot produce organic bananas? You do not have to answer that.

The demand for organic produce is, for the most part, in goods that we cannot produce ourselves, and you gave the good example of bananas. We meet the demand for organic lamb and beef. What proportion of the organic produce that we consume in Northern Ireland is made in Northern Ireland as opposed to being imported? You may not know the answer.

Mr Ervine: No. There are no detailed statistics on that. Generally, the statistics are recorded at UK level.

Do you want to comment, Leanne?

Ms McGrath: Going by what I have at hand, that information is not recorded or maintained, so I do not know.

Mr Martin: We know that we do not produce enough organic —.

Mr Ervine: We import it. Here are some of the figures.

Mr Martin: Do you have those statistics?

Mr Ervine: Each consignment of organic products coming from GB to Northern Ireland comes with a certificate of inspection. If you look at the trade figures for 2025, you will see that there were 1,152 consignments, which amounted to 19,000 tons of product.

Mr Martin: OK.

Mr Ervine: There were 6,400 tons of organic product imports from the rest of the world. That was primarily feed materials, such as soya: soya protein, soya meal and soya beans. That links to what I said about our bigger organic production sectors, which are poultry meat, eggs and beef. Equivalence in the rest-of-the-world trade is important to Northern Ireland's organic producers. For their continuity of production, they need that feed material to be recognised as equivalent and to be allowed in.

Mr Martin: OK. Am I right in saying that the 19,000 tons that we import from GB is three times what we get from the rest of the world?

Mr Ervine: Yes.

Mr Martin: That is fine. Thanks very much for that. It was interesting.

The Chairperson (Ms Ferguson): Thank you. Do any other members have questions? No.

I thank Brian and Leanne for their presentation. It was much appreciated.