Official Report: Minutes of Evidence

The Chairperson (Mr Mathison): We have a briefing from Pilib Mistéil, principal of Bunscoil an tSléibhe Dhuibh. I think that I got the pronunciation right. You can correct me if I am wrong.

Mr Pilib Mistéil (Bunscoil an tSléibhe Dhuibh): You were close.

The Chairperson (Mr Mathison): I do my best. We are very grateful to have Pilib with us. He will bring a specific primary-focused angle to the evidence that we have heard so far from post-primary principals. We welcome his evidence today.

You are very welcome. Thank you for joining us on a very warm day in the Committee room. Hopefully, with fewer bodies in the room, the temperature might cool down a little bit. I am happy to hand over to you at this stage to brief the Committee. I ask for an opening presentation of up to 10 minutes, and we will then move into questions and answers.

Mr Pilib Mistéil: Dia daoibh agus go raibh maith agaibh as deis a thabhairt dom labhairt libh inniu. Is mise Pilib Mistéil. Rugadh agus tógadh i nGaeltacht Bhóthar Seoighe mé. Tógadh le Gaeilge mé. Is é an Béarla an dara teanga agam agus is í an Ghaeilge an teanga labhartha s’agam. D’fhreastal mé ar an chéad bhunscoil, agus tá mé ag teagasc i nGaelscoileanna ó bhí na nóchaidí. Is í an Ghaeilge teanga labhartha mo chuid páistí agus mo theaghlaigh. Is deas deis bheith agaibh éisteacht leis an Ghaeilge anseo, agus agamsa, í a labhairt libh.

My very important politicians, thank you very much for listening to me today. I have six short points to make, and I will see if I can get through them in 10 minutes. I come from a preschool and primary school perspective. I have to stress the preschool aspect because Irish-medium (IM) schools and education are based on an immersion process that starts two years before primary school.

My first point is about equality and legal obligation. Irish-medium education is not a niche preference; it is part of the statutory and policy framework here. Under existing legislation, there is, as you know, a duty to promote and facilitate education where there is parental demand. However, if there are no commitments in law to promote Irish-medium education, it must also ensure adequate staffing to deliver it effectively. Otherwise, that right exists only on paper.

The second point is about demand versus capacity. Demand for Irish-medium education has grown significantly since I was in school. Many schools face difficulty recruiting qualified Irish-speaking teachers, an over-reliance on temporary or substitute staff and limited subject provision at post-primary level. There is also a lack of adequately qualified preschool staff, and, by "staff", I do not merely mean teaching staff but classroom assistants and playgroup supervisors as well. Without sufficient staffing, parental demand cannot be met, leading to inequality of access, long waiting lists or restricted subject choice.

The third point is about the unique staffing challenges in Irish-medium education. Unlike English-medium education, Irish-medium education requires teachers who are fully qualified and competent to teach through Irish. We need subject specialists, especially in maths, science, etc, who can deliver in Irish, and we need Irish-speaking classroom assistants. Given the big developments in special educational needs of late, Irish-medium schools are struggling to facilitate adequate classroom assistant provision in primary schools. Staffing shortages are structural, not incidental. A standard recruitment model cannot meet those needs without targeted intervention. The unique immersion education has never been resourced adequately. The acquisition of another language in preschool requires additional staffing to facilitate the process, yet the IM sector usually has a higher than normal pupil:teacher ratio.

The fourth point is about educational outcomes and quality. Insufficient staffing leads to larger class sizes, which is my reality; reduced subject availability; increased workload; teacher burnout; and Irish-medium teachers having to create their own resources, which I know has been raised again and again. That directly affects student outcomes. If Irish-medium pupils receive a narrower curriculum due to staffing shortages, that creates inequality in educational outcomes, which contradicts the principle of parity. It also drives a narrative that Irish-medium education cannot provide a broad and balanced curriculum.

Cultural and linguistic sustainability in Irish-medium schools is key to preserving and growing the Irish language and supporting cultural and community identity more broadly. Staffing shortages threaten not just schools but the long-term survival and development of the Irish-language community. I have an associated question: why has the Department of Education still not published an Irish-medium strategy after 55 years of its existence?

The sixth point is about economic and strategic investment. Investing in staffing creates skilled employment, builds a bilingual workforce and aligns with wider economic and tourism opportunities. Supporting Irish-medium staffing is not, in my view, a cost burden but an investment in skills, culture and regional development. Current pressures on staff in Irish-medium schools are curricular in terms of literacy. In English-medium schools, there is a plethora of novels and readers in English, but there is nothing by way of a broad and balanced scheme in Irish-medium schools. For numeracy, there are lots of online and hard-copy resources in English-medium schools, but there are next to zero resources in Irish-medium schools, with staff constantly searching for something, writing their own or translating materials in their own time. The last resource for mathematics for Irish-medium schools was created over 20 years ago. If you were to ask in an English-medium school how many schemes or resources it had in the space of 20 years, teachers could probably not tell you because there would have been so many. The situation is exactly the same for world around us and the rest of the arts.

If we were to go down the route of talking about SEN, we could still be here tomorrow. In short, there is no bilingual or Irish-medium diagnostic testing and no intervention resources. I note that, in a previous evidence session, a member of the Committee said that no educational psychologists are coming into Irish-medium education. Not one single recruitment has ever been made for a literacy support or outreach support teacher in an Irish-medium school. I am not saying that to kick the Department, by the way, but that adds to the workload for current staffing, because we have to pick up the pieces. Lots of special educational needs coordinators (SENCOs) work in their own time in area learning communities (ALCs) to provide support groups for themselves, create resources, assess and try to provide a more inclusive environment for children with special needs. They do that on their own.

Several years ago, the ring-fenced Irish-medium fund for the Council for the Curriculum, Examinations and Assessment (CCEA) was dismantled — I think that the term that was used at the time was "de-ring-fenced". It seems to us that that was an act to allow for the fund to be chipped away to meet CCEA's other priorities. I would be interested to know the figures for what has been spent on Irish-medium by CCEA today compared with the figures from when the fund was in place. The resulting financial decrease has added to the staff burden in the sector, as we have yet again had to pick up the pieces.

Another example of that is the recently introduced literacy inclusion toolkit, created by the Department of Education and the Education Authority (EA). At the launch of the toolkit, in autumn 2025, we asked how it could be implemented in an Irish-medium school. We were told that the toolkit was produced for "mainstream schools", which is quite insulting — that meant "not Irish-medium schools". That is just another example of the DE and Education Authority's (EA's) long-standing record of not taking their responsibilities seriously when it comes to Irish-medium schools and of what we have to do in them. As a result of that complaint, a small team of four SENCOs was recently hurriedly assembled. After long hours, mostly of their own time, they have just finished bringing this to a point of trial. We had to get substitute teachers into the schools to allow that to happen.

On the current demands on the system, in chapter 12.6 of 'Transforming Statutory Assessment: An Independent Review for Northern Ireland', the panel proposes a rapid development project to produce Irish-medium curriculum-linked assessments for literacy, numeracy and science, as there are none. In the last 50 years, we have had to create those ourselves.

In 2026-27, the coming academic year, CCEA will begin to roll out the new assessment framework launched by the Minister of Education that introduces new phonics and multiplication checks in years two and five of primary school. We have yet to hear from DE or anybody else about what that looks like in an Irish-medium school. Phonics in an English-medium school do not sit just as neatly in an Irish-medium school, because Irish is a different language. Nothing has been produced. That will result in our sending out more staff, who mostly have to work in their own time to try to produce a resource, and its implementation will happen well after the checks have been implemented in English-medium schools.

On the review of the Northern Ireland curriculum, last Friday, we received emails from the Education Authority and the Department of Education to say that there will be drafting groups for Irish, English and bi-literacy in Irish-medium schools. That will require up to 20 days out of school from September to December. We are already struggling to fill posts without having to send in more staff to fill in the holes that DE and the EA are not filling by failing to provide a proper workforce and support for Irish-medium schools. It is more of the same with CCEA, an creat teanga

and the literacy strategy, all of which have not taken account of Irish-medium schools.

We do not have enough staff as it is. We rarely have enough subs. As a result of DE and EA failing, or refusing, to plan, we are being asked to provide staff on what can only be described as a hodgepodge basis in the absence of a strategy. The continuous failure to plan ahead and to listen to the sector means that we are going round in circles.

To conclude, that all adds up to a significant failure to address the chronic workforce and workload issues in Irish-medium schools.

The Chairperson (Mr Mathison): Thank you. I will pick up on the theme of SEN, which I have raised in most briefings on the Bill. You made particular reference to that, and I assume that it is particularly relevant in a primary context where you need those support services early. Based on your or your colleagues' experience, can you give me an insight into the impact of not having support services such as educational psychologists, speech and language therapists and classroom assistants — some of the Youth Assembly Members referenced the experience in school of classroom assistants not being able to speak Irish — on the children who need those services and the staff in the schools?

Mr Mistéil: That is an easy one, Nick. Currently, nobody is qualified to diagnose a bilingual child as dyslexic here. Children in Irish-medium schools have to wait until they are in P5 to get a diagnosis, because the assessment has to take place in English. Other countries in Europe and elsewhere around the world have developed tools to diagnose dyslexia in indigenous children, bilingual children and — in Europe — trilingual children. There is nothing here. In an English-medium school, that happens as early as P2 or P3. There is therefore an immediate two-year gap in intervention. In a seven-year primary phase, a period of two years is huge. That is one sharp example. However, it is broader than that. There is always a question mark over diagnosis and the assessment process because we do not have any Irish-speaking experts in it. When asked about that, 10, 20, 30 years ago, the answer came back, "Funding" and, "It takes too long". It will take time. It will take time for universities, linguists, therapists and psychologists to come together and work those up, but start it, because we need it now. It is always the same excuse: it will take too long; we do not have the funding.

The Chairperson (Mr Mathison): It is clear from the evidence that the Committee has heard on SEN more broadly that all schools are feeling that pressure. However, if you are building in further delay in one particular sector for your children — the Youth Assembly was clear on that — that seems to be a clear inequality and indicates why the Bill is an appropriate intervention at this time.

I want to get your view on something. We have had some correspondence from the Department because there have been some queries about how it would interpret the word "workforce". I feel that the reply is encouraging, but it would be good to get your sense of it. The Department has come back to say that it should :

That broadens it beyond just the teachers and classroom assistants in the classroom. There is a question, probably a broader one, for us to discuss because it does not look as though they will be looking at health staff. However, in principle, would it be a welcome step if, when they do workforce planning, they also include the EA support staff and not just those who are employed in a school?

Mr Mistéil: The Irish-medium journey starts with the immersion process. In my school, that starts with children who are three years of age. We have a "pre-pre" stage. We have a primary, nursery or preschool, and also pre-preschool. It is a two-year programme about language acquisition. We advertised twice this year for a level-5-qualified supervisor for pre-preschool class. We got not one applicant. It is vital that we recognise that it is not just about teaching staff and specialists and that we are hugely dependent on all school staff. That includes classroom assistants who not only speak Irish but have qualifications in what they want to do; including in nursery provision. Irish-medium education is built on the playgroup, which is the starting point for ages 3 to 4. We need those staff as well, so it could not be and should not be as narrow as teaching staff. More teaching staff would be very welcome, but the ask is broader.

The Chairperson (Mr Mathison): I share that view. The broader the definition that is applied to "workforce", the better and more effective it will be. Thank you for that. I will bring in the Deputy Chair and any other members who indicate.

Mr Sheehan: Go raibh maith agat, a Chathaoirligh. Go raibh maith agat, a Philib as an chur i láthair sin. Bhí sé iontach suimiúil.

We often hear about the difficulties associated with Irish-medium education. It is almost as though it is an irritation. If we were to go along and say to the Minister, "We need 40 teachers for STEM subjects" or "We need 40 assistants for preschool, playgroup supervisors" or whatever, would that be a big deal for you? Is it possible to do that relatively quickly?

Mr Mistéil: There is a recent example of that in west Belfast: pupils in post-primary schools could not access design and technology GCSE, and there was not one teacher in any of the schools — not only in Irish-medium but in English-medium schools as well. I do not have the exact figures, but I think that 45 teachers — and the schools — have signed up to an access course of some sort, which they will do in their own time in the evenings over a series of weeks and months, to allow them to provide GCSE design and technology. That is happening; it is live. The Department of Education has to be involved in that. I do not know the ins and outs of it, but, when common sense prevails, it is easy enough. Obviously, there is funding involved in that, but it is not difficult. I do not see how it is difficult, given that there are shortages and the data and the evidence are overwhelming on that. We have to get over all that and ask at what point we will move from having a broad, general agreement that it is happening to deciding what we will do about it. Recently, in west Belfast — post-primary colleagues will be able to tell you more about this — practitioners have come together with schools and officials and created a pathway.

Mr Sheehan: What about international examples or experiences? Do you have knowledge of that?

Mr Mistéil: I strongly suggest that you invite our New Zealand colleagues over. Ten or 15 years ago, I visited Canada to learn about the bilingual system in Toronto. It was fascinating. There is a dedicated workforce strategy in Canada; the same exists in New Zealand and Wales. Scotland, I believe, is trying to do something similar for Gaelic. There have been some initiatives for access routes here and on an all-island basis, but, internationally, it is happening and has been proven to work and lessen the effect that staffing shortages have on indigenous and minority languages. The data is there; the research is there; and the practice is there internationally. As a sector, we do not understand why it is not here.

Mr Sheehan: All we need now is the will.

The Chairperson (Mr Mathison): I have no other indications. Jon, did you indicate?

Mr Burrows: My question has been answered.

The Chairperson (Mr Mathison): It has been dealt with. OK. You have had an easy ride today.

Mr Mistéil: That was a lot less intimidating than I thought it would be.

The Chairperson (Mr Mathison): We are a friendly bunch, honestly.

Ms Hunter: Chair, may I come in?

The Chairperson (Mr Mathison): Certainly, Cara.

Ms Hunter: I will just say thank you so much. I found that a really informative session. What we have seen over the past weeks has been so eye-opening. It is almost as if, with every session on Irish-medium education and its challenges in workforce and early years, the reality that our young people are facing gets worse and worse. Nobody could sit and listen, compare English-speaking schools with Irish-speaking schools, and not recognise that there is undoubtedly a two-tier system. Thank you sincerely for coming today. It speaks to the importance of the Bill.

Mr Mistéil: Go raibh maith agat.

The Chairperson (Mr Mathison): That is the end of our evidence session. We will ensure that the evidence is fed through into the final Committee report. Thank you for your time.

Mr Mistéil: Thank you for listening, everybody.